My 160J SSS Violet was first registered on 28 February 1979. I have been unable to locate a build date so far but not to worry. Unfortunately in these cases the DVLA will then give you a build date on the 31st December for your year of registration (Thus screwing you for more car Tax... C'est la vie, mes amis) so you cannot re-classify your vehicle as Historic (40 years old ) until after then. I found this out last February when I went to re-classify my Datsun at the main post office. Iwas refused. When I spoke to DVLA (on-line assistant) at that time I was told that I could apply on 1st January this year for Historic status, and so I did. Only to be told that I now have to wait until the car becomes Tax exempt on 1st April (which is when they do all this mularkey in bulk, apparently) thus screwing me again for another 3 months Tax. A recent article by Paul Lewis (BBC money geezer)in the Radio Times states that at 40 years old a car becomes Historic. It adds that, however, you cannot get Tax exemption until 1st April that year (or the year after if your car is 40 after 1st April?) which is when you can re-classify it as Historic. The first part is,apparently, WRONG. The second part is, apparently, RIGHT. I have confirmed that my car is MOT exempt (presumably from 28th February last year, as it WAS 40 then). I, therefore, cannot see the point in re-classifying my car as Historic when it becomes Tax exempt in April unless this is a DVLA requirement to do so. What are they playing at. Either a car is Historic when it reaches 40, gets MOT and Tax exempt,or it's NOT. Make your mind up! Beaurocracy....phah!
Post by geordiechris on Feb 24, 2020 21:52:16 GMT 1
Hmmm...that's really interesting. I have one car that is already historic (1967) but 2 more that are getting close. My N10 Cherry will be 40 next year but was registered in November 1981 so I presumed I would be able to apply then as the V5 clearly states that this is when it was first registered. So it would now appear I have to wait until the following April? I also have a Granada that will reach it's 40th birthday in 2022 but the same will no doubt apply I suppose. I am eager to get this accomplished because I fear that now we have left the EU it may not be too long before the rules change again and stop the whole thing (remember the Blair government stopped it and it was 15 years before the ball started rolling again).
Like most owners of classic cars, I cover very little mileage and keep my cars in top condition so forking out for an MOT every year...usually to someone younger than the car who has no idea how they work is just an expensive frustration. As for the tax...I think my old cars cause less damage to the environment than replacing them every few years with new ones...the biggest energy consumer is the manufacture anyway.
You're right. But the point is that DVLA are screwing people like me for more revenue when they could just make cars Historic on a rolling basis once they get to 40 on their build date or, if not available, their 1st registration date. Leaving it to 1st April means they can potentially get a flood of applicants which is, apparently, what they don't want (hence the twice yearly registration of new vehicles that they brought in). Anyway, I have now applied for historic status having now declared SORN (Don't want to give them any more money!) but I reckon that, with the lockdown etc. it'll take ages and I won't be able to "re-tax" the car until the V5c appears. The DVLA have a generally bad name in the classic car arena for such matters and they aren't doing themselves any favours in my case. Rant rant rant....
Post by geordiechris on Mar 31, 2020 16:56:02 GMT 1
Well you're probably right about that. For example, on one of my other cars (Volvo 740) I have fitted a Rover V8 engine. This does not change the tax status because it was already over 1.5 litres. I sent the V5 back with the new engine number and displacement. I sent a close up photograph of the engine number and the engine in the car. The paperwork was returned because they didn't believe me that the engine had been changed and stated that I would need to provide written evidence from the engine manufacturer confirming the cylinder capacity. How long had Rover been out of business? So I didn't bother...I just kept the evidence that I had tried to inform them and made sure my insurance company know about the modification.
When I inherited my N10 from my dad, it was on SORN for the winter. I wanted to change the ownership into my name and address but this apparently can't be done whilst retaining the SORN. So I had to wait a while with the car illegally not on SORN or taxed until the new document came back in my name before I could change it back to SORN. It's on the road permanently now but it was such an effort to simply change ownership.
Chris,in my view, relating to your SORN tale it is just another example of the DVLA overcomplicating issues for an apparently unknown reason.
Declaring SORN is in relation to VEHICLE EXCISE DUTY (VED). Change of names and addresses of REGISTERED KEEPERS is totally unrelated to VED.
What if a keeper has declared SORN and then the car is sold after he/she dies or is disabled to the point that they cannot un-SORN (?) the vehicle before sale? Or what if the seller forgets to mention that the vehicle is SORN and then sells it on?
The DVLA need to buck up their ideas on numerous issues.
Here's one I'm dealing with currently for a guy who originally imported a 1965 Nissan Fairlady SP311 to the UK many years ago. He has all the original import docs and DVLA application papers AND the original V5 from DVLA;
He recently noticed that the car is shown incorrectly as a saloon (and as a model 510 on the V5, as I pointed out). He is temporarily exporting it to the USA for historic rallying. Fearing a problem when it reaches there, he sent the DVLA all of the paperwork and photos showing the car with the DVLA issued registration number and it's convertible hood. They refused to amend the details from saloon to convertible until it had been inspected by "the original manufacturer" and "not the dealership that originally sold it".
I have completed an authority letter for the guy that, basically, states the bl--ding obvious!
It just beggars belief. I'm sure it is a training issue with the DVLA. Firstly train the staff to apply what is usually called common sense in these cases and, secondly, update their records with manufacturers who are no longer in existence or do not have records for older cars.
In case you are wondering about the outcome for the Fairlady.....so am I? I'll endeavour to update you in due course.
Update on my situation. It has now been 42 days since I sent off my V5 for change of address and historic vehicle status. I now read in last weeks Classic Car Weekly that DVLA have stopped processing paper applications other than for goods vehicles and essential workers vehicles. Hell's Teeth!!! They cannot give a date for resumption of the paper trail due to staff shortages. Thus, my car is trapped off road (SORN) until I get the V5 back and can "tax" it again on-line. The only saving grace is that it is safely garaged at my Mum's and COVID-19 means I can't drive it anyway. Hopefully, when the lockdown ends I will have got the V5 back and can do what classic cars are intended for...driving!
Latest update.... I was pleasantly surprised to have got the V5C back last friday! With it came a letter that basically said that they had changed my address but would now have to resubmit the V5C in order to obtain Historic status!!!! What the hell? I had filled out the changes section for Historic and actually sent them a letter with the V5C when I changed my address asking them to reclassify the vehicle as Historic.... and this is what they do.
However, looking on line revealed that I could do this at a main Post Office if I tax the vehicle at the same time. So off I went. The lady there entered all the details into the 'pooter and 'pooter said NO! It wouldn't accept it and wanted to charge me the full £270-00 (Yes, it all went up on 1st April).The lady couldn't understand it and asked me to come back on Tuesday, after the bank holiday, when her colleague who normally dealt with this would be in. (sigh) Note that the last time I did this at the Post Office with my Rover SD1 there were no problems.
So, on Tuesday I went back, queued up again with all the COVID-19 kit on and guess what.... it went through no problem and zero duty to pay! Hoo...B-----Y...ray! As a footnote, the new lady asked me to sign the V5C after entering the Historic change but guess what? There is nowhere to sign on the new V5C, so it looks like DVLA have changed the form and not told their counter staff. Says it all really. PS I guess I'll now have to wait another 8 weeks for another V5C to come through...... (sigh)
They could make it so much easier to do if they just accepted the 40 year cut-off date as either the date of manufacture or date of first registration. Then programme their computers to automatically flag up historic status with a declaration form attached to it that you fill in to say it meets their criteria (i.e.not modified). All done on-line.... simples! For those NOT on-line, just send the form off by post. In either case, no need to send off the V5C. Obviously TOO b----y simples!
Post by geordiechris on Jun 6, 2020 16:49:54 GMT 1
My N10 Cherry will pass 40 years since first registration November 2021. As it looks like I will have to wait until April 2022 before I can get it changed to historic status I was wondering how to discover the manufacturing date, just in case it was built before April 1981...and in which case perhaps I could apply for historic status next year after all?
Post by geordiechris on Jun 7, 2020 18:15:23 GMT 1
Thanks for all the help. I have tried the Nissan VIN decoder and it would appear the car was manufactured 01/08/1981 (which doesn't help the historic status as DVLA will make me wait until the following April anyway). The VIN on the V5 is abbreviated so I had to read it from the bulkhead. DVLA also seem to have got the model wrong as it is recorded as a 1.3GL and the decoder says it is a DX. I have heard this before and since my car has a 4 speed gearbox, no rev counter and no intermittent wipe I think it is a DX. I'm not going to argue this with DVLA as they will probably make such a blod-up that I will end up losing the V5. (this car has been in our family for many years and has never been modified).