N10 Cherry front wheel bearings (Read 287 times)

[geordiechris]

I have a 1981 Datsun Cherry 1.3GL which I inherited from my Dad. The car is in lovely condition and I have just put it back on the road after spending the last 18 months in his garage. One of the few things I still need to attend to is a noisy O/S/F wheel bearing. Looking through the history files my Dad kept, I can see that this bearing has already been replaced twice and has gone again (car has only done 44,000 miles). All the Haynes manual will tell me is that there is a spacer (doesn't say where) and that there are 18 possibilities of size and 6 special tools required? I guessing that the wrong spacer or pre-load must have been used when the bearing was replaced. Can anyone advise me on what is required to replace the part correctly please?

[Tero75]

The spacer is number 10 in picture. In Finland these spacers are no longer available by Nissan dealership but amayama.com claims that all the sizes are available through them.
You need to find a Nissan garage (or maybe Will?) who still has the special tools and knowledge to use them, or you can track used parts and just replace them. Cars with 1.0, 1.2 and 1.3 engines share same parts, 1.4 and 1.5 are different

[geordiechris]

Thank you for the message. I'm going to buy a new bearing and see if I can find anyone with experience of how to set them up. My guess is that when the bearing has been replaced in the past they have simply refitted the original spacer. The car is otherwise in lovely condition and I intend to keep it that way.

[geordiechris]

Well, I have now got the hub removed from the car and stripped as far as I can. There was a lot of freeplay in the bearing (I could move the wheel half an inch and on the other side there is no play at all). The O/S/F bearing has been replaced twice by a garage and it looks like they used a sledge hammer! I can't get the outer bearing off the drive plate and there is damage to the end of the flange where it has been repeatedly hit. I have a new bearing ready to fit once I have managed to get the outer bearing off somehow. The spacer is marker 11 but with a new bearing, I'm not sure how relevant that is. I think I've found someone who has some spacers, I just need to know how to measure everything. Surely it doesn't require a full build to check and then strip the car back down to change a spacer? Seems like a Heath Robinson design, which is so unlike the bulletproof engineering normally expected from Datsun. Almost no information available about correctly setting these bearings up...fingers crossed I can get the car back on the road.

[Tero75]

I'm sorry but it DOES need a full build for measuring, and then you need to strip it again to replace the spacer. You should always use a hydraulic press to build and strip the hub, never a sledge hammer!
To remove the outer bearing you need to use a bearing puller.

[geordiechris]

Thanks for your help. I have removed the outer bearing using a puller and everything is cleaned up ready for the new bearing to be fitted. I have managed to remove the damage on the inside of the splined plate with a deburring tool. I have access to a press etc at work and totally agree with you about not using a sledge hammer (shame the garage that did the job twice before didn't think so). It does seem like a crazy design...especially when everything else on the car is so well thought out and user friendly. The spacer I have removed was marked 11 and there was a considerable amount of freeplay. I'm guessing that a thinner spacer is required to close things up a bit? I've found a contact that has all the spacers...hopefully I'll have a bit more news tomorrow. It looks as though the bearings and seals are fitted in the upright in the normal way, but surely if you have to strip it back down the outer seal will be damaged? and then how do you put it back in? Thanks again for your help. Chris

[geordiechris]

This is where I'm up to. I built up the hub with new bearings and tried different spacers. A 13 seemed to be best as there was no freeplay and the hub spun nicely when pressure was applied by the hydraulic press at work. When I fitted the hub back onto the car and took it for a test drive, all the bearing rumbles had gone and it drove well. After 10 miles however I found that the hub was getting warm (not from the brake which is fine). Worried that the preload might be a bit too much I pulled the splined drive plate out and changed the spacer for a 15. This seemed to help as the hub can now be spun easily and there is no freeplay (there was a tiny bit but after tightening the driveshaft nut fully, this disappeared). Another 10 mile test found that the hub was still getting warm although not as much as before. The wheel spins freely so I'm not sure why. Not had a chance to drive the car again since then. Maybe now everything has settled in it will be okay. I don't want to keep splitting the hub in-case I end up damaging the new bearings.

[geordiechris]

Used the car a couple more times now. Drives very well but the O/S/F hub is still generating some heat (not a lot...but some). The brakes are fine and I can move the pads with my fingers. The wheel spins freely when jacked up and I now how a very slight amount of play in the bearing since I fitted a larger spacer. Don't understand why there should be warmth being generated. I can't have too much pre-load if there's very slight play. I've never come across this design of wheel bearing before...not sure whether to risk a long journey. Everything is fitted correctly, feels smooth...

[gainsb1]

Have you checked the warmth of the wheel against the other side? Inevitably there will be some heat generated just from driving and braking. If it is similar to the other wheel and not HOT then I wouldn't concern myself. Go for a drive/braking and stop every few miles to see what is occuring. If no noticeable change then there is probably nothing to worry about.

Leigh (Area rep)

[geordiechris]

Hi Leigh,

Thank you for your message. The hub on the O/S/F gets warm (uncomfortable to hold your finger on, but not blazing hot) whilst the N/S/F hub is cool. Both front brake calipers are cool and the heat appears to be radiating from the centre of the hub. The wheel nuts are getting warm too (only O/S/F) but the outer edge of the discs are not. I'm going to wait for the weekend and then I think I'll have to split the hub again. I do have a size 17 spacer I could fit which is pretty much the biggest available. I can't think of anything else to do but I do really appreciate the thoughtful help that is being offered. Chris

[geordiechris]

I've had the hub apart again! The bearing looks perfect. I fitted a 17 spacer but there was quite a bit of freeplay so I refitted the 15 and repacked the bearing with grease. Tiny amount of play in the bearing which I am happy about. The wheel spins nice and freely. I cleaned and checked the caliper just to be doubly certain that it is not binding. After a roadtest I thought all was well but after a couple of minutes the heat soak reappeared. Wheel still spinning freely. The heat is radiating from the centre of the hub. The only thing I am still unsure about is the inner seal. When I fitted the new bearings I replaced both seals. The inner seal only fits into the hub in what looks like the wrong way round. Then I noticed the there appears to be another seal on the CV joint which is very firmly located. The rubber circle on the CV joint looks like it is intended to run in the gap of the bearing seal and I have been told that this is correct by an old Datsun mechanic. I've just never heard of this before and I'm wondering if this is the cause of the heat? There is absolutely no information about these bearings other than one vague line drawing in a Haynes manual which does appear to show the shape of the rubber ring on the CV joint but it really isn't very clear. Has anyone done one of these before and can anyone tell me about the inner seal? I'm starting to doubt everything I'm doing now. Never had such a difficult wheel bearing before. Normally I would pay attention to how something came apart and rebuild it the same way...but what if the garage that did the bearing before did it wrong? Any advice appreciated as always. Chris

[geordiechris]

I have finally got to the source of the problem and this is that the aftermarket hub bearing kit is supplied with an incorrect inner seal. This must have been the case when the wheel bearing was replaced previously. After stripping the hub down yet again I found evidence that the inner seal was spinning in the hub and generating heat from the friction. The rubber seal on the driveshaft CV joint was actually the remains of another inner seal that had been left in place. Once I was able to remove it and inspect the inner seal again I managed to modify the the seal to make it fit into the hub the other way round (this was a tight fit and required a slide hammer to pull it fully home). The seal now stays securely in the hub with the CV joint spinning inside it as it should. I have since driven 500 miles without any issues. I have since managed to obtain a genuine Nissan inner seal (or dust cover as they call it) from Japan with the help of Brian Carter at Fred Coupe Nissan in Preston. The correct seal has a metal surround and is a completely different shape to the one supplied in the bearing kit. For anyone interested this part is still available through a Nissan dealer although the delivery time is 4 to 6 weeks and it comes from Japan. Part number is 40227-M3005.

Hope this is of help to someone...thanks everyone that offered me advice. Chris

[gainsb1]

At last! Congratulations on your perseverance. I'll make this a sticky so it doesn't get lost.

Leigh (Area rep)